0 (2s):
Who’s ready to rock today, Fire Nation? JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network. With great shows like I Digress. Today, we'll be breaking down how to fuse experiences and storytelling to drive business growth. To drop these value bombs, I brought Arjun Bhatnagar into EOFire Studios. Arjun is the CEO and founder of Cloaked, a consumer-first privacy startup, dedicating to bringing humanity back to the internet. And today, Fire Nation, we'll talk about the art of storytelling, why storytelling is so important for entrepreneurs. We'll talk about the decision on what products you choose to create is one of the biggest decisions you will make.

0 (42s):
We'll talk about building the right team and so much more. And a big thank you for sponsoring today's episode goes to Arjun and our sponsors.

Shopify (53s):
Chaing! That's the sound of another sale on Shopify. The platform trusted by millions of entrepreneurs to create their online store and so much more. Sign up for a free trial today at Shopify.com/onfire, all lowercase. That's Shopify.com/onfire to start selling online today.

HubSpot Podcast Network (1m 12s):
Success story hosted by Scott D. Clarey is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network. The audio destination for business professionals success story features Q and A, keynote presentations and convos on sales marketing in more. A recent episode on how to protect your business in times of crisis is a must. Listen, listen to success story wherever you get your podcasts.

0 (1m 35s):
Arjun, say what's up to Fire Nation and share something that you believe about becoming successful that most people disagree with.

1 (1m 45s):
Hey, excited to be here today. I think one thing I believe in that most people disagree with that makes someone successful is the idea of not necessarily, even though it's really contrary to think about business, is not necessarily about money or the profit right away. It's about value creation. And it comes in the perspective of when you're either starting your own business or need investing in yourself. It's about trying to grow yourself, the value you're able to create, your skills, your development, not necessarily finding short change or shortcuts in terms of money. The more you invest in yourself, the more invest in your business, the higher likelihood of success that can

0 (2m 23s):
Happen in Fire Station. Right now, you're investing in yourself, you're investing your time into listening to this content, which we're talking about how to fuse experiences and storytelling to drive business growth. So I wanna start Arjun with the art of storytelling. Why is storytelling so important for entrepreneurs?

1 (2m 45s):
It's great you asked that. So storytelling I think is the biggest skill as an entrepreneur. I'm a CEO of a startup, but a lot of people, entrepreneur journey, you find storytelling is the biggest skill you can create or hone and sharpen. It's because when you do that, you're not only finding a way for yourself to be motivated, excited, beginning the whole world, excited about what you're seeing in the world. And actually all comes back to this point where I think about, I mentioned this quite a bit a number of times, but Atkins Law of Spacecraft Design, I don't know if people have heard of it, but it's a really interesting point that I kind of learned from one of my team members where I was like, Well, what's, what's going on in terms of what you're trying to do for business?

1 (3m 24s):
Well, Atkins law, spacecraft design, he kind of talks about for building spacecraft, applies to everything. And it's that a bad concept with a good presentation is doomed eventually. But a good concept with a bad presentation is doomed immediately. And it comes back to the story trying to tell. If you're not excited about what you're doing, if you're not able to have someone else see why you are looking to make a dent in the world, change the change in the world, then there's no way you're gonna make it, make it, make it anywhere. And I think it comes with having the right story that you're willing to put out there. The story that you are believing in everybody around you is believing

0 (4m 0s):
It. Fire Nation. I love how that makes it so clear about the importance of storytelling. I mean, if you don't have a good story, no matter how great your product is, if it's fantastic or it's horrible, it's dead on impact. But if you have a fantastic product and a fantastic story, that's the road to success. If you have a fantastic story and a crappy product, people might still figure it out, but they'll figure it out down the road because they're gonna fall in love with your story. So of course you never want to have a crappy product, but it's at least gonna have you get past the start line when you have a great story and hopefully always be improving in making whatever it is that you're creating that product, that service better and better and better.

0 (4m 42s):
And speaking of stories, Arjun, let's see how you, the master storyteller tells your story.

1 (4m 49s):
Yeah, I always find that either a quick or long way to say, but if my name is Arjun, I've been an entrepreneur for 16 years. The joke is that I've actually been, since I was 10 years old, I got my first job and I started my first business when I was 11. But I've been from an engineer to scene engineer, cto, all through the entire technical chain at big enterprise companies, Fortune 500 s to startups through my, throughout my whole life. And so I've always been passionate technology, but I also got into startups. I sold my first startup back in 2016, right when I was in college. I started my second one, which grew decently well, but ultimately failed. I took a break and said, You know, I wanna learn about vc.

1 (5m 30s):
I became a vc, helped start a VC fund, investing in pre startups. Then I got the big aha moment for my third startup Cloaked, which I'm super excited about. And I've been off to the races since then. Yeah. But someone who's always been interested in technology and also nonprofit a little bit along the way, I've also started my own nonprofit where I build schools in the Philippines.

0 (5m 49s):
Well, one thing that I've realized in the over 3,700 episodes of Entrepreneurs on Fire is that we love stories. In fact, if you look at history, which was actually my major in college history, his story, her story, I love Bring bringing in that her story part of it too. Cause I don't want it just to be his. But that's where the word history came from. Stories, his story, her story, the stories, the word passed down over generations around fireplaces, like we are always drawn in to. Once upon a time, we lean in because we know a story's coming. We want to hear that story. So tell us the story of your current startup Cloaked.

1 (6m 30s):
Yes. So Cloaked the consumer privacy company, putting you in control of your data. And the story starts off because back in 2020, I was really curious about my own information. How could it help my life? How could I be better between my finances, my personal life? I just knew there was a better way of doing things. So I was like, Oh, let me just take an understanding of what I look like digitally. So I bought a Mac Mini and put it in my apartment and sent to write integrations into everything about me from the basic stuff like Facebook, Google Calendar, to more complicated stuff. I hacked iMessage, I got all my health kick data, my eating data, my workout data, my movement data, my social media posts, everything about me.

1 (7m 12s):
I streamed to this box. And on the background of machine learning, sort some basic ml, it started telling me, Hey, you missed this meeting yesterday. You missed this workout yesterday. Why don't you do 15 pushes between these two meetings? Based on my spending habits, it'd say, Hey, let's cut back on the alcohol this week. But it really hit me in the face one day when I was actually at lunch with somebody and I put my phone down at the end of lunch, I picked up my phone, I realized my really crude AI had actually had a full conversation with my then girlfriend. It actually said, I love you, sent her memes. And it went back and forth. And when I picked up my phone, I realized the whole conversation was over. And then I remember just standing there looking at it, I was like, Wait, what just happened? And I was like, Wow, this is pretty cool.

1 (7m 53s):
But two big important things hit me in that moment. One, I realized that I don't own any of my own data. And two, I don't trust Facebook, Amazon, Google, and these companies to make something like this. So we've hit a real blockage in innovation in how to help ourselves as humans and people, because we have a big lack of trust in technology. There's a big invasion of privacy. So I said, I wanna solve the privacy problem altogether. And here we are with Cloaked and I'm really excited about where we're at today.

0 (8m 28s):
If you could really just drill down into the number one solution that you provide to people that have a real problem in your niche, what is that?

1 (8m 37s):
Yeah, so I've realized really digging deep is that the whole industry has backwards about what does security and privacy mean to the everyday people? Our ecosystem focusing on the everyday people, not just people who are super obsessed with private security. Drilling down into it, I realized that what we all care about is this idea I call comfort. We mix the word security and privacy all over the place. And I think of the idea that security is this encryption, fraud, fingerprinting, what's my vector attack privacy? Where's my data live? What's access? What's it look like? And it's this layer to the third letter that no one talks about that I'm really focused on is comfort. And it's a cognitive point in which we all understand the problem.

1 (9m 18s):
So when we're doing it, quote is in every single situation, when you're browsing online, when you're doing apartment hunting, when you're buying something, when you're meeting a cute guy at the bar, setting up for rewards, we create a unique identity on the fly and it's, and it's a real working phone number, email address, password, and soon credit card that's tied to your actual information. So you can use iMessage, you can use your email client, you can use your actual credit card, but no one has access to you or your direct access to your personal information. And these aren't throwaway or burner. They're permanent working identities paired to a website, paired to a person. And you can turn them off, snooze them, control them, personalize them how you see fit, but it makes it so that your information doesn't belong with anybody else but

0 (10m 3s):
You. And in today's age, Fire Nation. And it's only gonna get more and more scary as we go forward with everything that's going on. And cyber attacks, scams, all these different things. I mean, you need to take control of what you need to take control of. And you know, for you only you know that Fire Nation. But believe me, it's time to take inventory and say, what do I need to protect?

1 (10m 25s):
We're gonna be talking about a lot of great things and more when we get back from thanking our sponsors.

Podopolo Podcast App (10m 31s):
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Podopolo Podcast App (11m 13s):
Join me on Podopolo where you can interact with me, connect with others, ask questions, and share your thoughts on your favorite podcast. Visit Podopolo.com, download the app for free from either App store, mention JLD or EOFire when you sign up for an account and start listening now. That's P O D O P O L O.com.

Shopify (11m 36s):
Oh, now that's a sound I like to hear. What is it you ask? That's another sale on Shopify. The all in one commerce platform to start, run and grow your business. Shopify makes it simple to sell to anyone from anywhere. And I speak from personal experience. We view Shopify to sell physical products as 2015, whether selling dog treats or decanters, start selling with Shopify and join the platform simplifying commerce for millions of businesses worldwide. With Shopify, you'll customize your online store to your brand, discover new customers and build the relationships that will keep them coming back. Shopify covers all the sales channels to successfully grow your business from in person to an all-in-one e-commerce platform and even across social media platforms. And thanks to 24 7 support, Shopify is here to help you succeed every step of the way.

Shopify (12m 20s):
It's how every minute new sellers around the world make their first sale with Shopify. And you can too. Sign up for a free trial at Shopify.com/onfire. All lowercase. Go to Shopify.com/onfire to start selling online today. Shopify.com/onfire.

Hubspot (12m 39s):
Feeling connected to your team is a must, but with employees and contractors all over the globe, feeling that connection can be tough. Not to mention, the software you use can sometimes make you feel outta sync like you and the rest of your team aren't on the same page. And when a team is disconnected, your customers pay the price. If the software you're currently using is sharing out of day data on your business or your customers, that equals trouble. Or maybe you feel like your software is making impossible to see the full picture. If that's the case, then listen up. Customers end up bearing the brunt of this disconnection, meaning a great customer experience is lost, sometimes forever. Ready to get your team on the same page. HubSpot transforms everyday conversations, strategic decision making sessions and everything in between into moments customers feel good about.

Hubspot (13m 24s):
With a lovingly crafted suite of tools, you can seamlessly connect your team so everyone has access to the same data and you're able to focus on what really matters Your customers. Learn how HubSpot can help your business grow better at hubspot.com.

0 (13m 40s):
Arjun, we're back. And deciding which products to create is often the biggest decision that entrepreneurs will make. Talk about how storytelling and how storytelling can shape how we build out our products.

1 (13m 56s):
Yeah, so Cloaked actually started the, where we're starting for our, our V1 came from a story I was telling myself, I thought about privacy and security, how do we approach this space? And I was like, Well, what if we could change businesses and change the way they have the infrastructure? But I realized that's a really hard story to tell because you have to convince businesses where they're not necessarily aligned to change the way they operate. They're focused on profits and data exploitation. That's how they work. And even the ones I do that are convinced it's a slow burn one after another, after another. And I remember going on for a run and I was like, Well, why? Why can't I do this? Why can't I? What's the product I should be building?

1 (14m 38s):
And as I was on, it hit me, I was like, Why? What if I could just work with consumers? Because they're the ones who feel the pain, they empathize, they connect. And then it all started coming together around, Oh, what if we could start really simple? Because everybody makes security really difficult. VPNs encryption, changing apps, make all of your friends go to a different app altogether. I said, Let's make it really simple that people can grasp their head around. And I think for me, it all comes back to I knew that's the story I wanted to tell. One that was simple. People could easily grasp. They have that idea that this connects them viscerally.

1 (15m 18s):
They feel that problem, they're energized by the solution. And I, when I was energized by that, that story myself, I was like, Well, this is the path I wanna go down. And it comes back to what I even thought in the beginning was I could easily pivot our business and become a B2B business and help protect people's databases and make them more secure and make pretty good killing and going the hundred millions of dollars. But I knew my goal is I wanna change how the world works. That's the way I view what I do day to day. Everything should make an impact. So I knew that this was actually a path to making impact, is that we aligned people themselves. So I think for entrepreneurs when they're thinking about building their product and storytelling is that it comes back to how do people resonate with what you're trying to do?

1 (16m 5s):
And you wanna set the appropriate goal. My goal is to change the world, change how you interface the technology and interface with the internet, How we interact with each other technically and digitally to make innovation much smarter in the future. Putting us control of our data and our privacy, giving us a sense of control. And I knew that's my goal. If the goal is that I want to make a side business or kinda do drop shipping and these things, well set that goal properly and then find a story you want to tell. Even in that moment, you want your thing that you're selling to be something that people love or excited, they wanna spend money on buying. And the way you put your marketing, your landing pages all convey that story. So I think you have to figure out what people, what you resonate with, and then channel that out.

1 (16m 47s):
Otherwise, there's no other way you're gonna tell a story that attracts a product or it convinces you about a product you wanna build.

0 (16m 51s):
Are you on a path to create impact Fire Nation? I love that phrase. I just love that methodology. Look in the mirror. Ask yourself that question. And by the way, not everybody wants to change the world and how we interface with the world like Arjun does Fire Nation, and that's fine, That is totally fine. But are you on a path to create impact? Because if you're gonna create Impact Fire Nation, if your story shows how you're going to create that impact, you're on your way. Now, building the right team is so important, Arjun, but it's so tough. How did storytelling help you attract the right team?

1 (17m 26s):
I think storytelling was the only, or the biggest skill I had. I think from storytelling, this really key elements between somebody joining your team, they're betting on a lot of things when they're jumping on your ship. One I, I talk to my team all the time that I think we're all in one boat together and we all have our own role. Me leading the charge is just a role on the ship. It's not that I, it's all, we're all doing what I say, We all have a role to play. And I think I fall more into the leadership side and the way I operate. But it's, we all are doing some part of this. When I talk to somebody, a particular candidate or somebody interested in, I make sure that they know that I'm someone they can trust professionally.

1 (18m 10s):
I've had the experience and background and technology and products and leadership and say, Okay, this person has some thinking or can they share that this is something that they feel confident in taking on and their experience ties to what they're trying to do. I tie about my experience from the job, et cetera. Then I jump right into Cloaked or jump into, in this case for Cloaked. But for a business, it's that we think about not only competition and why we're doing it better, it's because you have a unique perspective in the world. Because when somebody's joining your company, even if it's in any perspective, they want, they want see the world from your lens and they want feel excited by that. And I think that's where I think about from bringing, attracting the right team.

1 (18m 53s):
I saw people who really saw that the world can change and they feel that they have the skills to join me on the journey and they're excited by me. I think the biggest thing is they're attracting someone on the team. Half of it is absolutely the business, your market, your opportunity. The other half that's really important is that they want to bet on you. I, myself and my co-founder that they, people our team was really attracted to and excited to join us. And I think we are, We also treat people very respectfully. And I think that's a big dimension that we're very respectful to the people we're talking to, the way we operate and ends up being that this is a guy I'd like to hang out with and and work with. And that's why I think despite me not asking, I get messages from my team members at four in the morning to all the way at 10 at night where they're, they're themselves excited about Cloaked in our business because they want to push that forward.

1 (19m 43s):
So I think me having the right story, the way I talk about myself, the business, the market, and where we see the world changing, I think really helped me attract the really strong teammate team members across the board

0 (19m 56s):
Fire Nation. I really hope you're understanding the value and the power of stories when it comes to attracting the right people. And rj, I mean, I'm convinced, I think Fire Nation is convinced they wanna tell the right story. But here's the question, what's the next step?

1 (20m 12s):
Well, I think there's key elements to taking the next step if you want it. If one, you're convinced that having the right story is important, I think there's a few, there's only a few points that you have to really iron out. The first thing I talk about is that it starts with you. Who are you? What, what's what? What's your background? I always have a short version of my talk myself, a long version. You wanna kind of talk about the key points about what you are excited by, what's your background, things like that. And then the next part about that stories that you want gen to is like think about how do you keep it personal? Because every every person who's listening to you wants to take a chance, take a bet on you and what you're doing.

1 (20m 53s):
So you want to think back as like, well, your customers, your team, they're all aligned to what you believe in to tie it back to you and what you think about in the world, what you wanna change. I always think about from that perspective, you're telling a story. Well, from voice transition from you, you want think about how do you make it powerful and stand out. What you're doing for your business should be something that's elicits excitement, energy. One, it could be profits. It doesn't have to be changing the world. It could be making money and making a really good approach. You're buying real estate property or you could be getting into trying to make a startup. I think both those aspects is a powerful statement you can bring out to the world people connect to. And then I always kind of end with this thinking of, well, you always give it a hero, right?

1 (21m 34s):
And biggest thing that the next step is like, well, what is the hero on my journey? And it's not necessarily you. It's you and the company and the approach you're thinking and making sure that people can highlight that you are actually going out and taking market share from other people. You have to stand out. You wanna be telling a story, worth telling. And so if you're gonna take a market share from other people, you wanna make sure that you have a much stronger approach. So I think these kind, this approach of starting with you, keeping it personal, making it powerful, having it stand out and giving it a hero are the key elements. I think of a story that when you really sharpen, you could tell it in a minute, you can tell it in 10 minutes, you can tell it in 30 minutes, and people can, and you can really expand and practice that.

1 (22m 18s):
And I think that is the next step, is ironing out what those points mean to you.

0 (22m 23s):
Have a story worth telling Fire Nation. That's a great place to start in Arjun. If Fire Nation wants to connect with you, your company, tell us how we can do that. Give us any call to action you have for our listeners, Fire Nation, and then we'll say goodbye.

1 (22m 38s):
Yeah, absolutely. One, we'd love for you to check out Cloaked. We are in public beta having consumers come in every day trying out Cloaked and it's fully in action. So you can join us at Cloaked.app/eof. It'll skip the waitlist. You can also reach out to myself directly. I can give you unique Cloaked on the fly, Arjun, Cloaked.id. That's a unique Cloaked for this audience that you can reach out to me. But yeah, always excited to hear from entrepreneurs. People are excited about doing business and I always love to pay it forward. So if I can help any way, we'll be happy to, Fire Nation.

0 (23m 13s):
You're the average of the five people you spend the most time with. You've been hanging out with AB and JLD today, so keep up that heat. Head over to EOFire.com, Type A R J U N in the search bar. His show page will pop right up in. Who doesn't like skipping? Wait lists? Fire Nation Wait lists are for people that aren't in Fire Nation. So Arjun, where does Fire Nation go to skip the Cloaked wait list?

1 (23m 41s):
Yeah, if you just go to Cloaked.app/eof, it'll, it'll help you skip the the wait list. When you hit join, join Early Access.

0 (23m 49s):
Arjun. Thank you for sharing your truth, your knowledge, your value with Fire Nation today. For that, we salute you and we'll catch you on the flip side.

1 (23m 57s):
Sounds good. Thanks so much for having me.

0 (23m 59s):
Hey, Fire Nation, a huge thank you to Arjun for dropping value bombs and sponsoring today's episode, Fire Nation. Are you ready to rock your very own podcast? Check out our free podcasting course where I will teach you how to create and launch your podcast for for free. freepodcastcourse.com. I'll catch you there. Or on the flip side,

Shopify (24m 21s):
Chaing! That's the sound of another sale on Shopify. The platform trusted by millions of entrepreneurs to create their online store and so much more. Sign up for a free trial today at Shopify.com/onfire, all lowercase. That's Shopify.com/onfire to start selling online today.

HubSpot Podcast Network (24m 40s):
Success story hosted by Scott D. Clarey is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals success story features Q and A, keynote presentations and convos on sales marketing and more. A recent episode on how to protect your business in times of crisis is a must. Listen, listen to success story wherever you get your podcasts.