0 (2s):
Light that sparked Fire Nation. JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs On Fire brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network with great shows like Salesmen. Today, we'll be breaking down culture. How an entrepreneur can build their dream team to drop these value bombs. I brought Jason Haugen and EOFire studios. Jason is a husband, father, serial entrepreneur and business owner. He's also the CEO of the Haugen RV Group and over $100+ million dealership group across multiple states. And today Fire Nation, we'll talk about showing up leading from the front, our job as business owners, creating winning cultures and incentives for your team and so much more Fire Nation.

0 (45s):
When we get back from thanking our sponsors. Still think you can create an online course the same way you did five years ago? Think again. Thinkific has looked at the top 20% of course, creators to see what they're doing now to be so darn successful. Find out for yourself at thinkific.com/firetrends. Business made simple hosted by Donald Miller, takes the mystery out of growing your business. Recent episodes, like how to attract and retain top talent and how to make more money with your current products are straight fire. Listen to business made simple wherever you get your podcasts. Jason say what's up to Fire Nation and share something that you believe about becoming successful that most people disagree with.

1 (1m 33s):
Hey, how's it going? Thank you for so much for having me. I think one thing that people disagree with is taking risks. I mean, with anything in entrepreneurship, you have to definitely take risks. And I know a lot of people just are not willing to do that. And step out of the box

0 (1m 47s):
Fire Nation. It's no fun inside the box. Let's get out of that box. And as I mentioned in the introduction, we're talking about culture today, specifically how an entrepreneur can build their dream team. Cause Fire Nation, you can't do it alone. You shouldn't want to do it alone. So we're talking about all this jazz today and you believe in the maxi showing up, Jason, what does this mean to you?

1 (2m 13s):
Definitely. I think one big thing with entrepreneurs with business owners, CEOs is they kind of expect a lot of people to do things that they wouldn't do themselves. And so when I tell people to show up, it's, it's definitely something where like, you need to show up for your team. You need to lead from the front. And I think, you know, we're going to get to that in a little bit, but you definitely need to show up and show you you that you're a United front, especially if you have like an executive team, you all need to be on the same page. You all have to be speaking the same language, if you will, and just, you know, be, be together and show up for your team. Like, you know, it's, if there's something important going on, if there's a big event, definitely show that you care.

1 (2m 54s):
Because a lot of employees in, in my experience, they just, they just work and they do their thing and they always think their bosses don't care about them. Whether it's a manager, it's a, it's a general manager, it's a, you know, a regional manager, a CEO, a business owner, whatever it is, they just believe, you know, in their heart that they just don't care that they're just there to make them money.

0 (3m 15s):
I love that phrase show up because one thing that I really resonated that Gary Vaynerchuk talks a lot about is a lot of people come to him and say, why, why Gary? Why does it, my team work as hard as I do? Why doesn't everybody just get to the office early, stay late, give everything screw work-life balance. Like why don't they have the same passion and fire as me? And he's like, well, number one, like you're probably not showing that passion and fire to them enough, but number two, like you're the leader. You are the person that has ownership and equity in the company. And they're there for a paycheck. They're, they're getting a salary. Maybe they have a little bit of equity, but nothing to the magnitude that you do as well. So how can you expect them to do that?

0 (3m 56s):
Especially when you're not doing the things we'll be talking about here today. One of those things, which you did kind of allude to a little bit, Jason leading from the front, let's talk about this and give some examples.

1 (4m 7s):
Leading from the front is so important because like I said before, it's really hard for me. At least in my personal self is to do something, to ask someone to do something that I, I would never do myself. And it's not that if you can't do it, people get that confused. If you, if you are unable or you do not have the skill, obviously like you are going to ask, like in my line of work, it's, you know, I with dealerships, like I'm not going to be out there turning wrenches. I, I probably could, but I don't know how to do that. But they, they know that I would be out there talking with them, doing anything I can to help them. You know, I've watched, you know, vehicles before I've done wash trailers. I've done all these things when they know that. And so showing that you will come in and you will help them and you are leading from the front and you are, you are, you know, expecting the same thing of yourself as you are from the team.

1 (4m 55s):
The thing I, you know, I always call it the seagull mentality. And I don't know if you ever heard of the seagull mentality, but basically it's, you know, a lot of bosses managers come in, you know, they might come into the line of work or come into the business and they kind of, they fly in a, you know, excuse me for my language on everything. And they fly back out and it really frustrates people that they come in, they change the world and they, they, they, they leave. And especially if you have businesses across the country or multiple stores or anything like that, have you just walk in and you walk out. And so when you're leading from the front, you're, you're doing the things that you ask your team, you know, the, of what you want them to do for you. And you're showing them and you're walking alongside of them.

1 (5m 38s):
You're not just barking orders. Hey, do this and do that. You are, you are, it's literally a, you know, a team effort and I a hundred percent believe that

0 (5m 45s):
Fire Nation, that philosophy is so common in the workplace today. And it's so sad because it just is demoralizing. It makes people feel like, well, I'm being micromanaged. Like does my opinion, not. You need to be thinking about things like this when you're running your company, when you're leading from the front for your employees. And Jason, you do know a little bit about this, but Fire Nation, the people that are listening here today, they're entrepreneurs, they are small business owners. They are side hustlers. They're people that are getting into this world of entrepreneurship or have been here for a while, looking to grow expands. Let's talk specifics about what our job as a business owner is take that away.

1 (6m 24s):
Definitely surprised me because I've had multiple meetings. I've been in multiple, you know, meetings with different businesses. And when I go meet with them as a vendor and I always ask them what they think my job is, and they always come up with different things is all you, you know, your job is to obviously make the money or, you know, to make the decisions or do this and do that. And ultimately it comes down to my belief is I'm here to serve the people and whatever that means, whatever, whatever I can do to help my executive team and, you know, any manager in, in my company, it's always the set, their people up for success. And if you're constantly thinking about how can I set my people up for success, how can I better my people? How can I make them more money? How can I help?

1 (7m 5s):
And even if you're just by yourself, kind of think about how can I get better today and what can I do to help, you know, most of it's most businesses that are helping a need out there are covering a need or, or, you know, they're, they're supplying a service. And so how can I help my customers? How can I help my people? And, you know, my thoughts used to be, how can I make more money today? What can I do to make more money? And it just got such a negative, like feeling in, in me that I just felt bad. And I, I couldn't even go to my stores and look at people in the face and say, I care about you because I didn't. And when I changed my thinking and changed, how can I serve them? And how can I help them and how can I make them more money? And what can I do to better them and look at their systems and look at everything to do with, with what they're doing.

1 (7m 50s):
And if I hear complaints or hear this or hear that, okay, let's check out your, you know how it's rolling out. Let's, let's do everything we possibly can and set you up for success. Get the tools that you need for success. That's what I believe a business owner, a CEO really needs to focus on.

0 (8m 4s):
Can you answer that question yourself? I, our nation, what is my job here? Have you ever asked yourself that question? That's a question you need to know. Forefronts. Are you there to set your people up for success? Are you doing that day in and day out and ask yourself that question? How can I get better today? And Jason, this is something I typed out when you were talking. And I'd like your feedback on it. I wrote money should be the result of your actions. Not the sole focus.

1 (8m 33s):
Exactly. I a hundred percent believe that. And when you get so focused on money, it's like, you just, you become a different person. And, you know, there are some people out there that I do know that are very successful as far as dollar wise, but I wouldn't associate my name with them. And some of them have a lot of money, but just how they deal with their people. And they deal with me and they deal with people in the public. I just don't believe that they're doing the right things. And eventually I think that, you know, things will come around and it might burn and hurt them. But I a hundred percent believe that you take the focus off the money and you focus on the people, things, things will turn around and things will change

0 (9m 13s):
Fire Nation. Would we be talking about a winning culture? We're gonna be talking about incentives and events for your team members. When we get back from thanking our sponsors as an entrepreneur, just starting out or looking to scale up, it can be tricky to know which advice to follow. And if you've been thinking about making an online course, part of your business, the Thinkific Trends Report is one of the most important things you'll read this year. The team at Thinkific analyzed the top 20% of creators to discover what they're doing differently to make them so darn successful in this report. You'll uncover why top creators are two times more likely to use communities three times more likely to sell courses and bundles plus learn why it's time to say goodbye to the hard sell. I can say after reading it, that this report is chock full of insights.

0 (9m 55s):
You can immediately put into action today, because if you're still creating courses the same way you were five years ago, you might be missing out on some big opportunities to discover which trends are powering the most successful creators in 2022, what their secrets are to growing their business, how they focus their time in much more visits, thinkific.com/firetrends. That's T H I N K I F I C.com/firetrends. This year feels like the official return of conferences and in-person events. And I'm very excited to be speaking live on stage at this year's Inbound 2022 events in Boston. Inbound 2022 is happening in person and online September 6th through the 9th.

0 (10m 39s):
Kate and I would love to see you there this year. The in-person experience will include festival style stages, including the podcast age what's next stage. In the main stage, aside from hosting a live interview on the podcast age for Entrepreneurs On Fire, I'm fired up about the connections and inspiration. That'll be all around us at this year's event. If you can't join us in Boston this year, there are several other pass options available like the start-up pass, which is your free ticket to the spotlight talent prices are increasing, and there are only a limited number of VIP tickets available. So be sure to check out Inbound 2022 today. Inbound 2022 was built by you powered by HubSpot. Learn more or get your tickets now at inbound.com.

0 (11m 23s):
Jason, we're back in, as we mentioned right before the break winning culture, you believe a winning culture is both creating goals and objectives for your team and measuring them keyword, measuring them. Talk to us about this, give us some specifics.

1 (11m 41s):
I totally believe that, you know, creating goals, creating objectives for your teammates to do, and then creating incentive programs is a huge thing because people, what I found is, you know, you can money, doesn't solve all problems. And so if you just keep throwing money at people and you keep throwing, here's, you know, here's this and here's that they, it doesn't accomplish the goal. And so if you create objectives or goals around what you are trying to accomplish and what you're trying to accomplish, maybe in that specific store or that specific month, customize it to, if you have, you know, one employee, two employees, three employees, or a team, you know, we, we customize our incentive programs to departments or teams, and it's very different for every store we have because every store is very different.

1 (12m 30s):
And so maybe they're trying to hit at a certain efficiency. Maybe they're trying to, you know, hit a certain, you know, sales goal or something like that. We totally customize around them and make it achievable. But we also put like a kind of a crazy goal out there that everything would have to happen. Perfect. And it's a crazy goal, but you know, it's out there and here's the incentive that you get. And a lot of people, and we found a lot, a lot of times they hit it because if you put it out there and you know, it's kind of the new, it, it's, it's, it's what everybody's moving for. And it's really important that every single person on the team is moving towards the same goal and they know what that goal is. And then it's not a competition between each other. It's a helping each other.

1 (13m 11s):
It's helping lift the entire department. It's helping lift the entire company to whatever incentive or whatever thing they're going to get, I think is super key. It can't, it cannot be, it can be a healthy competition between maybe, you know, the same department in different stores or maybe the different departments within the store, but at the same team at the same time, you're all on the same team. Like, you know, it, they have to know that and that, and it's there, it's there to help them. And the crazy you've found is they'll say, you know, they're trying to hit a sales goal of, you know, a hundred thousand dollars a month or something like that. And they've never done it. And you create an incentive program where they go and they hit that goal. And it's just amazing. You celebrate them, you do something gnarly.

1 (13m 52s):
And what I found is that kind of becomes the new baseline. And it's crazy because there are some times where we've never hit a goal and we hit it and then we keep hitting it and keep hitting it and keep hitting it. And then that's just the new norm. Then you have to set, you have to raise the bar

0 (14m 7s):
Fire Nation. Are you creating a winning culture? Are you creating goals? Are you creating objectives? Are you measuring them? And something I'd like to talk to you about Jason that maybe you've seen, or you haven't, but what about gamifying? This whole thing? Like making it fun, making it exciting. I mean, this is kind of a weird example. I'm giving you a little time to maybe think about somebody you've worked with, or you do this in your team right now. That's, you know, it goes way back to my days in corporate America. And I'm not saying this is a great example because it wasn't necessarily fun, but I will say I did kind of light my little competitive spark. I will say that is that I was in corporate America at John Hancock. And I was making outbound phone calls every single day about a variable annuity product.

0 (14m 50s):
That was what my quote unquote job was as like a 27 year old in corporate America. And they had this leaderboard that was just always flashing total talk time, and most phone calls and your name was up there. And the winner for that day would get a flag on their desk that just essentially said, you know, this person was yesterday's leader, so to speak. And I will say, didn't, you know, really add a lot of fun per se, but it did add some competitive spirits and some competitive juices to the whole game. So something that's maybe a little less corporate than that, but have you seen a way that's people have gamified these goals, these objectives measuring them as well.

0 (15m 32s):
What have you seen?

1 (15m 33s):
A hundred percent? I think that that is, is a great thing to be able to see everybody what everybody else is doing, because it definitely creates that that competitive nature, right? That's what you just said. So what we do is we actually have a program that everybody's numbers go into every single day and it's it's alive. And so everyone is seeing what every store does and you know, down to the individuals in that store and no one ever wants to be last. And, you know, every week they come up with a different incentive program or every month different incentive program. And I think it's pretty cool. We also have a texting thread that everybody texts me and my, my COO and my, my inventory manager and a few other people, every general manager or sales manager will text us and tell us their numbers for the day.

1 (16m 20s):
And we're just making an exciting, and sometimes we're, you know, we're talking a little crap here and there, but it's, it's a fun thing. And no one ever wants to be last, but at the same time, we're always picking each other up. Hey, you know, it looks, you know, you didn't hit your goal today. No problem tomorrow just got to do a double, you know, whatever you gotta do. And so it definitely will keep people competitive, but you cannot make your own company like a blood bath. And I've seen that before where people, it gets so competitive that people start to sabotage and it's like, it defeats the point. And I have conversations with different business owners and different managers of like, you are literally, you are worse off now than you were before you did whatever this incentive program is.

1 (17m 1s):
So you really have to make sure it does not get so competitive that people are trying to sabotage the company at the same time, but you got to make it competitive and friendly enough where people definitely want to, you know, compete and, and accomplish the goals that you created for them, or they created for themselves. Because I think it's also healthy for me. You know, I always ask them, Hey, what do you think you can do? And they will tell me, and maybe we'll push it or maybe be like, oh, Hey man, you're way off. Like you got to raise the bar or sometimes they, you know, maybe you got to adjust that or whatever you got to do there.

0 (17m 31s):
I think that last point is really spectacular. And it brings you back to a time. I was lucky enough to spend four days in Fiji one-on-one well, it was really one on 10 because it was us and nine other affiliates with Tony Robbins. And we got to ask him one question. And one of the questions that I'm glad somebody asked him was how do you incentivize your employees? And he says, it's a personal one-on-one basis. He sits every one of them down and says, what would make this job? What's one thing that would make this job, the best job for you. Is it a four, four work week, week? Is it coming in at 10:00 AM instead of 8:00 AM? Is it blah, blah, blah. Like, is it money? Like, what is the one thing that would make the shop, the best job for you?

0 (18m 13s):
One that you'd be like, I can't replicate this benefit at any other job. And that was just this huge thing that whenever people were thinking about leaving, and of course churn is such a pain point for all business owners, they were saying, well, man, like the money may be a little better, or this might be a little, a more interesting or, or yada yada, but they're like, but I'm not going to get that if I leave, because Tony's giving me this, the one thing that I asked for above all and everything else. So some of the thing about, and let's really talk about incentives. Let's talk about events for team members. You mentioned it a little bit, a couple of sections ago, but I want to get deeper into incentives into events specifically for those team members.

0 (18m 53s):
Are they important? And if so, how do you execute?

1 (18m 56s):
100%? You know, what I believe is you create, you know, fun incentives. And a lot of times I let them create them for their own teams and they kind of come together. What would be a good, what would be fun? You know, really popular one out there. There's top golf. Everybody loves top golf, but you know, we, I believe like, you know, one fun thing that we just did actually was for my, all my GM's in the stores. I just took them down to Las Vegas, to race, race cars around the race track for a couple of nights. And that was a blast. And I really, I really believe in incentive programs or events because money, like if I give someone a, a 2003 or 5,000, or even a $10,000 bonus, you know, in my eyes, they're just going to go buy tires or go change the oil in their car or go buy groceries.

1 (19m 44s):
But if you create an event or an experience that they will never forget what their peers, and especially if you have businesses across states or across, or, or different stores, they don't, you know, it's, it's really tough for them to feel the culture. And when you're trying to really build the culture, what I really want to do is create that system that that is every store it's rinse and repeat. And so we'll, we've really focused on creating the store and camaraderie between the stores. And so we get them together a lot. And so they know each other because in our line of work, we're using each other's inventory, we're bouncing ideas off each other. We're doing, we're working together a lot. And like I said before, you don't want to create such a competitive nature that you make it, you sabotage your own company.

1 (20m 24s):
So we try to get them all together. And so when you take them down to Vegas, you do fun dinners. You give them money to gamble, you spend time with them and you know, it's a cliche, but you break bread with them. There's something different about that, where you create a bond that, I mean, sometimes you gotta be careful with it because at the end of the day, you know, better employees and you're a business owner and you have to treat it as one thing, but as long as they know that you care, and then there's, there is some sort of bond there. I really think that's important that they will go do the extra things for you. And this was a few months ago or a month ago, whenever it was. And I'm S every time I go to the store, I hear the stories because it's kind of funny. I w you know, I was telling them, Hey, you know, be careful don't crash the cars than I am.

1 (21m 6s):
The only one that spun the car out. And so they give me crap every time that I go to the stores. But I think that that's really important that that experience would have never happened if it was just a transaction of, I just gave them $10,000, because what I do not want, and in my life, whether it's personal or business as a transactional relationship. And I think that if employees or business or whoever you are working with, even your vendors, if they feel like the only reason you are there as for a transaction, I do not believe that they will treat you the same as if someone is treating them very differently. And having that relationship based business or relationship based transaction with them, where it's more of a, Hey, you know, let's figure out a win-win situation or whatever that is.

1 (21m 48s):
I believe it'll help you go way further. And when your employees, you know, it's not just, oh, Hey, throw money at me. And to make me happy that no, we really thought this out. We flew everybody down there, pay all expense, paid for them and their significant other, or a plus one. So we could spend time with their wives, husbands, whoever it was of girlfriend, boyfriend, whatever. So we could get to know them so they could see the innards of what we do. And so they can get that support at home. Cause I feel like that's super important. So we try to include everybody. And when you do events or incentives, I think that you really have to think about everybody. Even when we did top golf for departments, we always ask their significant other to come. I think that's very important.

0 (22m 27s):
There's a lot of value here. If I, our nation, I mean, at the end of the day, at the core human desire, it's we want to look cool. We want other people to look at us and be like, he's cool. She's cool. Like, they've got something cool going on. I mean, that's a lot of times why people buy the cars that they buy, where the clothes that they wear, buy the houses that they buy, all these different things. So giving your employees like an extra check. So they go buy tires and go, Hey honey, I just bought four more tires for our car because, you know, I got a bonus. It like, that's good, but what's great is taking your wife or your husband or your significant other on this epic trip. That's being sponsored by the company and nothing's coming out of their pocket.

0 (23m 9s):
And they're just wined and dined top-level experience that builds family that builds real commitment and loyalty. And I love that stuff. I mean, that to me is a great way to spend the excess funds you may have as a business owner. So Jason, take the microphone, take us home. We talked about a lot of things today. Incentives, events, winning culture. We've talked about leading from the front and even just showing up in the right way. What is the one thing you really want to make sure Fire Nation gets from everything that we've talked about here today?

1 (23m 41s):
And this sounds kind of cliche, but, and in, you know, it might be really hard for people to do, but love your people. Think of them as an asset, not just as a way to get your money because they can feel that. And I can, you know, I can go into a business and I've done a lot of consulting. And I also have, you know, I'm, I'm launching a podcast called culture camp and where I interview a lot of people. And I get really frustrated when I go meet with people or meet with, with companies. And all they're doing is just talking crap on there. Their employees are like this and that. And you know, if you change your mindset and you love your people, things will be different for you. And it's going to be tough. You might have to call a reset. You might have to bring your team together. Or even if it's just yourself, go lock yourself in a room and figure out how to make.

1 (24m 23s):
I mean, if you're not accomplishing your goals, whether even if it's just a sales goal or a monetary goal or whatever is happening, take the focus off of the money and the dollar mountain trying to squeeze the rep, focus on the people and how to create them and make them better. And I believe that they will have your back and it will pay 10 times the amount that you invest in them. And have you showed that to them and you walk alongside with them and you leave from the front and you, you do whatever you can to help them and set them up for success. I believe it will pay off for you. And because it has, for me, you know, I almost have 200 employees or a little more than 200 employees. So the companies and they're loyal and we treat them like king sometimes. And you know, when we have to let people go, they know, and you know, we, we, we have an entire formula of how we treat them and how we do things.

1 (25m 11s):
And even how we write them up and do all things. And it's all surrounded by our culture. And so if you come out with this culture or you say, you have a culture, definitely practice what you preach. I think that's huge.

0 (25m 21s):
So I've got like an interesting piece of feedback here and, you know, you're the culture king here. You're the expert. I'm not, but I will just give you one piece of feedback that I've always just kinda thought about. Whenever people have said, you know, how many employees they have? They're like, I'm like, oh, so how many employees you have? They're like, oh, like somewhere like between 20 and 30 or like, oh, you know, over 200 or like this or that, I'm like, you don't know the exact number. Like you don't know the exact number of employees. And I know there's churn and there's turnover, but for me, I would actually make it a pride point to be like, I have 204 employees. Like tomorrow I might have 203 tomorrow might have 207, but right now I have 203 employees. And I know that like when an employee hears that they're like, like mine, my number ma like I'm here.

0 (26m 3s):
That's why it's 2 0 3. Like not 2 0 6, 2 0 4 or 2 0 2, 1 of those things. So what are your thoughts on that?

1 (26m 9s):
I think that's powerful. I definitely think that that is something I could, I could do. And I can have my, if you have an HR department, they can send you a report every single day. It's not that big of a deal.

0 (26m 18s):
And the title would just be like current count, boom. Like there's a tool six. And it's just like, that's just a number, you

1 (26m 22s):
Know, that's powerful for

0 (26m 23s):
Sure. Just something I've always thought about. Like, I've really always had that thing whenever I'm interviewing any founder. And they're just always, and it's not so much, like when you get to, I get into the hundreds of different boom, they're like, yeah. Like I have like, like somewhere like 10 to 20, I'm just like, wow, like you don't know, like, like, you know, I know the, I know like the exact name and like address and like birthdays of my three employees, but I have three, so that's easy, but you know, my point is like, that's like an extra touch that can be pretty special. So Jason, how can we connect with you? What ways can Fire Nation learn more from you? I know you have a podcast coming out, which is great. So that's super cool. Any other call to action you have, and then we'll say goodbye.

1 (27m 3s):
So you can join my mailing list at, iamjasonhaugen.com. And you can also find me on Instagram at just Jason Haugen. And that's H A U G E N, Haugen. And yeah, we'd love to connect, you know, a podcast launch in July 20th. I have a lot of people on there, you know, from super bowl champions to business owners, CEOs, presidents, whatever it's going to be exciting. And in my whole goal with this is just to teach culture because I think it's a lost art.

0 (27m 26s):
And that was July

1 (27m 27s):
What? July 20th.

0 (27m 28s):
That's so weird. Literally the day this is going live. I'm looking at the schedule right now is Wednesday, July 20th. So Fire Nation of Jason is able to keep up with his podcast, aspirational launching goals. His podcast is live today, July 20th, which is crazy. That's so nice. That's so random. So Fire Nation, you're the average of the five people you spend the most time with. And you've been hanging out with JH and JLD today. So keep up the heats and head over to EOFire.com, just type Jason, J A S O N in the search bar. And the show notes page will pop up with everything that we've talked about here today. Best show notes in the biz.

0 (28m 8s):
Jason, thank you for sharing your truth, your knowledge, your value with Fire Nation today, for that we salute you and we'll catch you on the flip side.

1 (28m 17s):
Thank you.

0 (28m 18s):
Hey, Fire Nation today's value bomb content was brought to you by Jason. And over the last decade, I've interviewed more than 3000 of the world's most successful entrepreneurs, and I've created a revolutionary 17 step roadmap to your financial freedom and fulfillment. I put it all into my first traditionally published book, The Common Path to Uncommon Success personally endorsed by Seth Godin and Gary Vaynerchuk. The Common Path to Uncommon Success is the step-by-step guidance that you need to achieve the lifestyle of your dreams. Visit UncommonSuccessBook.com. UncommonSuccessBook.com and I'll catch you there or on the flip side

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Still think you can create an online course the same way you did five years ago? Think again. Thinkific has looked at the top 20% of course, creators to see what they're doing now to be so darn successful. Find out for yourself at thinkific.com/firetrends. Business made simple hosted by Donald Miller, takes the mystery out of growing your business. Recent episodes, like how to attract and retain top talent and how to make more money with your current products are straight fire. Listen to business made simple wherever you get your podcasts.