0 (2s):
Boom. Shake the room, Fire Nation, JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire, brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network with great shows like Duct Tape Marketing. Today we're pulling a timeless EOFire episode from the archive, so the giveaway may not be active and we'll be breaking down how to go from Chief Everything Officer to Chief Executive Officer to drop these value bombs I have brought James P. Friel into EOFire Studios. When businesses are ready to scale, they call James Friel. He's a secret weapon, helping many of today's well-known entrepreneurs become successful CEOs breaking complex problems into small actionable steps as his superpower in Today's for Nation will talk about how a system is a combination of people, process, and tools and needs to be coordinated to achieve an outcome.

0 (43s):
And how to get into the habit and the mindset of being an effective CEO. Don't fall into the trap of being the aforementioned four types of bad bosses that we go over in the episode. And so much more Fire Nation

LMNT (55s):
and a big thank you for sponsoring today's episode goes to James and our sponsors. LMNT is an electrolyte drink mixed with everything you need and nothing you don't. Try it totally risk free today. Visit drinklmnt.com/eofire and get a free sample pack with any purchase plus a no questions asked money back guarantee. That's drinklmnt.com/eofire.

Outbound Squad (1m 19s):
Outbound Squad hosted by Jason Bay is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Tune in for convos with leading sales experts and top performing reps to help you land more meetings with your ideal clients. One of my faves, the monthly app with Jason Ethan, where they share hacks, tips and tricks. Listen to Outbound Squad, wherever you get your podcasts.

0 (1m 43s):
James, say What's up to Fire Nation and share something interesting about yourself that most people don't know.

1 (1m 52s):
What's up Fire Nation? Great to be here, JLD. So I think one of the things about me that most people probably wouldn't know unless you're my parents, I, my first big sale in my career was actually selling my swing set. Whoa. When I was like eight or nine years old, you're

0 (2m 10s):
Like, I'm done with this for sale.

1 (2m 12s):
Yeah. Well it was really funny cuz I was home alone and my neighbor came driving up our driveway and he knocked on the door and he is like, Hey, are your parents here? I was like, no, they're not here. And I just figured the conversation would end and we just kind of stood there and was awkward for a minute. And he looked over at my swing set. He is like, oh, that's a really nice swing set. And I looked over at it realizing exactly what you just said, and I was like, well, do you wanna buy it? And he said, really? I was like, yeah, sure. I was like, I'm not using anymore. Why don't you make me an offer? And, and he, he

0 (2m 41s):
Offers like five bucks.

1 (2m 42s):
I sold it for 75. Whoa. Yeah. He is like, all right, I'll take it. And I was like, perfect. So he goes driving down the road and my parents see the swing set hanging off the back of his truck and they're like, was that your swing set? I was like, yeah, I just sold it.

0 (2m 56s):
Your parents are like, we spent $745 on that. Sweet. Exactly. Exactly. Well, Fire Nation, as I shared during the intro, we're gonna be talking about how to go from chief everything officer to Chief executive Officer, and we have a lot of great grounds to cover. And James, I actually wanna start by talking about the genius paradox. Why do most people get stuck in their business?

1 (3m 24s):
Yeah. Most people get stuck in their business because they're really good at something. And most people start a business because you have an idea for a product or a service or whatever it is, and you're good at that thing and you start doing more of that thing and you create success. And it's almost like, you know those, you know, Chinese handcuffs where you put both of your fingers in?

0 (3m 48s):
Oh

1 (3m 48s):
Yes. Right? Like the harder you pull the like, the harder it is to get out. And I think the better you are at your thing, the more success that you create and what winds up happening. Like if you picture, you know, a, a pie at first when you're starting, you're getting to do your thing, you know, 50, 60, 70, 80% of the time. And the more success you create, the more other things that you create while you're doing that thing, right? You now have more customers, you have bills that need to be paid, people that are working for you, potentially, all these different things. And so that percentage of the pie that you're working on, your zone of genius, which is the catalyst for growth, starts shrinking and shrinking and shrinking.

1 (4m 34s):
And sooner or later you're like, man, I'm not even getting to do the thing that I'm, I'm good at the thing that I love. The thing that I was so excited about when I first started this, because there's all this other stuff. So it's almost, it's sort of this cruel joke. The better you are, the faster that success happens. And then that creates this whole new set of problems.

0 (4m 54s):
Kinda reminds me of the book a little bit, E-Myth Revisited and you know, where they're just kind of like talking about how this person, oh, they love baking muffins. So they started a bakery and then they just realized like, huh, like I'm no longer doing anything to do with baking, right? Like, I'm doing all the things, but, and that is kind of like potentially that issue that you're getting into. And I think that's really fascinating about the genius paradox too, is like, man, you're just really good at that thing and you kind of get stuck doing that thing because you're so good at it. And like in your mind, and a lot of entrepreneurs have this problem, like we think like, oh, nobody else could do it. Like I could do it. And guess what? They might not be able to do it a 10 out 10 if you're quote a 10 outta 10. But like, if you can get somebody doing something like a seven or eight out 10, that frees you up to do other things, to grow and expand your business and to actually fulfill your vision, that's something to definitely think about.

0 (5m 44s):
Now, let's be honest, systems are massive. I mean, we have built entrepreneurs on fire on the back of systems and automations. I mean, it has been critical for us. So why is our business growth limited to the, the fact that we'll never be able to exceed the capacity of our

1 (6m 1s):
Systems? It's a great question because I think that, you know, people generally are more excited about the, the result that they can create than the system. And, and I, I'm right there with you, right? Like I, you know, told you about selling my swing set, right? Like, I love sales, I love working with customers and that sort of thing. And even though a lot of people know me as a systems guy, they think it must just be like, I just like wake up every morning and I'm like, oh my God, you know what I want to do today? I just want to build more systems. But what, like, what I really want to do is I want to grow my business. Like I want to grow my business. I want to have a life. I want to have, you know, the, the ability to work on the things that I find meaningful and important.

1 (6m 46s):
And, but at the end of the day, like I'm only one guy, and even if I have a team of people, we are only so many people. And each one of us has a limited amount of resources at our disposal. It doesn't matter who you are, whether you're a solopreneur or you're Jeff Bezos, at some point there's a, there's like a finite amount of resources that we all have to work with. And, and systems are the gateway to freedom. And, and, and the way that, the way that I like to explain it is systems give you leverage and leverage is an incredibly important concept that I think a lot of people talk about, but is misunderstood. And, and I remember the first time I learned about leverage was not in the business context.

1 (7m 29s):
My dad was, my dad was a mechanic and so he was always working on cars in the garage. And I went out to the garage one time and, you know, he was kind of under the hood doing something and, and I asked him if he wanted any help and he is like, yeah, just, you know, grab that wrench and take that bolt off of this, you know, part of the car. And I was like, okay. So I grabbed the wrench and I'm like, I'm pulling on it and this thing just like won't break. And, and I'm like, oh my God, so what's, what's my reaction pull harder, right? So I'm pulling harder and he walks, you know, he walks away so he doesn't see what I'm doing. I'm like standing on the engine of the car and I'm like pulling on the thing. And he comes back in, he's like, what are you doing? I said, well, you wanted me to get this off, but I don't like, I'm not strong enough to get it off.

1 (8m 10s):
And so he is like, hang on a sec. So he walks to the other side of the garage, grabs his three foot length of pipe, puts the pipe over the handle of the wrench. He's like, here, grab the top part of this pipe. And I did. And I pulled, and the, the bolt immediately broke off. And that was the first time I was like, wait a second. I put less effort in and I got the result way easier. Right? And, and systems are the leverage that we need in our business because we, we only have so much time in the day. We only have so many people on our team. We only have so many resources to use human capital and financial capital to do things that could be systemized is not the best use of resource.

1 (8m 51s):
And so our business growth is ultimately bottlenecked by how effective our systems are

0 (8m 59s):
Fire Nation. I think it's so key to really recognize the fact that systems will give you leverage, they'll give you the ability to scale. And I love that visual that you gave James about the fact that, hey, let's take a pipe on the end of this wrench and then all of a sudden something I couldn't move five seconds before now because of leverage, I'm able to do it and I'm able to do it fairly easy. Like, it's, it's not super difficult. Yeah. And so like, whenever you're finding yourself being like, man, this is so difficult. Believe me, there's a better way. And you know, a lot of times people ask me, they're like, John, like how have you been able to build the business and the success that you've been able to achieve so far? And like, I'll answer with a straight face.

0 (9m 39s):
I'll be like, I'm a tweaker. Like I'm literally a tweaker. What I mean by that is, every single time I do something, I'm typically just doing a little tweak, a little leverage, a little something, just a little twist that's just making that system a little bit better. But guess what, when I have made a hundred tweaks, you know, over a hundred days, like that compound effect has been massive. And so like, I am always tweaking things. I'm always addressing, I'm always looking for that, that system that's gonna gimme that leverage, that ability to scale. Now, when a lot of people think of leverage and scale and freedom, James, they think, wow, well I just need to hire people. Cuz hiring people yeah, will make things easier.

0 (10m 21s):
It will make things better. Is hiring a team gonna do that? For sure.

1 (10m 26s):
It's not a certainty. There is absolute value in having a team. I totally believe that. But I also think that unless you have, unless you're setting up systems, then your team is just a drain on you, or it could be a drain on you. You know, it's expensive to have people and it takes time to manage those people. And so I think a lot of times when people run into bottlenecks, they say, oh, well just, you know, just throw money at it and hire somebody. And more often than not that, that doesn't really fix the problem because you never got to the root of the problem. And if, if hiring people is always a solution, then you really haven't dug deep enough.

1 (11m 7s):
And, and it kind of brings me to the point that I wanna make about what is what, like what really is the system, right? We throw this word out a lot and people say, oh, you gotta systemize things and just create a system. And, you know, it's kind of become a buzzword and I'm glad that there's awareness around it, but, but the definition is, is critical. And back at when I left my corporate job like nine years ago, I was running my first agency and I had a lot of sales and marketing success, but delivery and keeping everything on track was a total mess. And I just thought maybe I should just hire people. And so I had like this revolving door in my business for a year and a half where it would be like one person after the next, after the next, and it just wasn't working.

1 (11m 52s):
I was like, man, like what, what am I doing wrong here? And I zoomed out and created a definition of a system that has helped me ever since. And a system is a combination of people and processes and tools and all three of those things need to be coordinated in helping you achieve a certain outcome. And so if you are hiring people and plugging them into a system where there's processes and tools to help them get their job done, you know, people do the thing, processes, help them know what to do, and the tools support them in that effort, then hiring people is a great idea. But if you're just gonna throw people at a problem, then you're gonna, you know, you're gonna have a, a much bigger mess.

1 (12m 35s):
And it's, it reminds me of a story and you and I are both good friends with Russell Brunson. Oh yeah. And Russell Russell's been a client of mine and I helped him put systems in place in his business. But one of the, one of the stories that he shares is in his early days, you know, he had like a team of 6, 7, 8 people and they'd just be kind of sitting around while Russell did all the work. And it's like, man, if your team is just sitting around while you do all the work, that means that you haven't fully integrated 'em into a system and really it's just costing you money. So the right way to think about hiring people is how do you plug them into that system that is a combination of people, process, and tools, all trying to achieve a similar outcome.

1 (13m 15s):
See,

0 (13m 15s):
I love that. I just wanna repeat that one more time. Fire Nation. That a system is a combination of people and processes and tools all trying to achieve an outcome. Like that is just such a great way to look at that process, to look at what a real system will do, a profitable system will do for you. Now, Fire Nation, if you even think we're closed to done dropping value bombs, you have another thing coming. We're gonna break down the four types of bad bosses and so much more as soon as we get back from thanking our sponsors.

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1 (15m 49s):
So James, we're back and there are not one, not two, not three, but four types of bad bosses. Let's break each one of those bad bosses down one by One. It's important to recognize this because I think we've all probably, as I'm gonna talk about, we're we've all seen ourselves become these types of people in one shape or form and having awareness around this and what to do about it is the thing that can help really drive growth. When we're, you know, when we have the systems in place and we're managing a team, we don't, we don't wanna show up as these four. And so the first one is what I call the hypercritical boss. Okay? This is the person who needs to be right all the time.

1 (16m 30s):
They're, they're kind of judgmental of other people's contributions or opinions. Nothing's really ever good enough. They tend to think they could have done things better themselves. They're sort of like driven by anger. Maybe it's outward, maybe it's passive aggressive, whatever. And their team is not really empowered, but they're sort of dependent on this person for solutions and that ultimately stumps growth. And so the team doesn't grow because they're always worried about this. You know, this person who's, who's hyper-critical. And so that's on one side. And then on the other side you have sort of the opposite person who is the people pleaser? And this is the person who really, really wants to be liked by their team.

1 (17m 10s):
It's super important that everybody thinks they're a good person. They want to keep the peace and avoid conflict and difficult conversations and, you know, potentially even have self-sacrifice in order to avoid that conflict. And, and even though they, they tend to think they could have things done, do things better themselves, they just volunteer to take on more because they're trying to make sure everybody likes them. And so they wind up having resentment towards their team because they're, you know, they're doing their team's job and they're not really addressing the issue. And this leads them to feel like, you know, they're a victim and wishing that things were different, but they're unwilling to make a change. And so you've got sort of these two on one spectrum. And then on the other spectrum, we kind of have this, this concept of presence, like am I more present or less present?

1 (17m 57s):
So being too present is the helicopter boss and this is the person who's, you know, constantly hovering over the team, worried that everything's gonna fall apart if they're not involved. They're the, the dominating micromanager. They do everything themselves because they don't trust other people to do things correctly and they're driven by fear of losing control. And then the opposite of that person is the absentee. And we've seen these people plenty of times as well, you know, they're, they're bothered when their team needs them and they think that what their team is doing is beneath them and they just kind of want their team to figure things out on their own cuz they think most things aren't worth their time. In many cases, they're likely to grant premature ownership of tasks and responsibilities cuz they don't wanna be involved and they're driven out, they're driven by the fear of missing out on other more important things.

1 (18m 45s):
And so, you know, there's, there's these two spectrums that we both, we all can fall on. And our goal is, is to recognize these tendencies that, that we have and how we show up as leaders and managers and to bring things towards the center to this concept of, of what I call being an engaged leader who is, you know, showing up, giving feedback, willing to have the difficult conversations, giving the right authority and autonomy to people and being engaged when is necessary. And so it's, it's really important that we recognize that, you know, it's not your fault if you're showing up like this, but once you have this awareness, how can you become an engaged leader instead of showing up like one of those four types.

1 (19m 27s):
Now

0 (19m 27s):
Let me put you on the spot here. Which one of these four is your least favorite type of a bad boss?

1 (19m 35s):
My least favorite type is probably the absentee because I'm like, man, if you, if you have a business, like get your roll up your sleeves and like be the business owner, like be an engaged leader. And I think it's hard to do that if you just feel like everything is, you know, out there and not really supposed to be like, requiring you at any level

0 (19m 56s):
And which is the one that you think is probably the easiest to make an adjustment and become a good boss. Even though right now you might quote unquote be a bad boss.

1 (20m 5s):
I think that with the right delegation systems in place, it's way better. And I think it's easier to go from being the helicopter person who's like always micromanaging

0 (20m 16s):
Things, hovering everywhere. Yeah,

1 (20m 18s):
Totally. Nobody, nobody likes to work like that. It's exhausting for everybody and, and with, you know, systems, people, process tools, but then delegating things like who's gonna do it, when's it gonna get done, what exactly needs to be done? And making sure that you have feedback loops on those systems. I think it is easy to move away from being that helicopter boss, which nobody really likes.

0 (20m 39s):
And it's empowering too to your employees and the people on your team Fire Nation when you're just like, you know what, this is what I want you to do now. You go do it and you figure out how to do it. And I'd love for you to come up with a better way than maybe I'm showing you right now, but like at the end of the day, this is your job. Come back, take control, take power, take ownership, this is yours. You're empowering these individuals now to go out, take responsibility. Now they have pride in this thing, Fire Nation and someone has pride in something, man, they do not want to screw up. Like they want to be proud of something worth being proud of. Now, if we really wanted to break it down to the core, because we hear the word hustle all the time.

0 (21m 19s):
I mean, we said the, we said Russell Brunsons name a few times, you know, people look and they see that he seems like he's always hustling around, like he's doing Instagram stories, live speeches from stages, webinars, writing books, doing all this jazz. What's the difference between a hustling entrepreneur, somebody who's just hustling and an effective CEO?

1 (21m 40s):
This is such an important topic because I think that there is a, there is a big difference, but it's not immediately clear on the outside, right? Because I'm not saying that you're gonna achieve success without putting work in because it takes work to build systems, to build a team, to build a business that's valuable. But I think the key distinction between a hustling entrepreneur and an effective CEO is that a hustling entrepreneur, if you look at them today, they're gonna be grinding today, but you look at them a year from now, they're gonna be grinding on a very similar problem. A quote that I really like is, you know, don't ever be working on the same problem a year from now.

1 (22m 20s):
Like, you could be working on a worse problem, a better problem, a different problem, but don't make it the same one. And I think a hustling entrepreneur is somebody who's just like waking up, going through the grind, doing the same thing day in, day out, and they're not creating any foundation for themselves to stand on. And, and contrast that with an effective CEO, an effective CEO is somebody who recognizes that if you are building a business that's going to be an empire, right? And you have ambition to build something of significance and substance, then that empire is built on the bricks of systems. Yeah, right? You, you constantly need to be replacing yourself and other people with these systems.

1 (23m 4s):
And so part of your job as an effective CEO is what systems need to be built. So that 30 days, 60 days, 90 days a year from now, we are not working on the same problems. We've solved those problems and now we've moved on to bigger and better things, whereas the hustling entrepreneurs can still gonna be working on the same things a year from now. Fire

0 (23m 25s):
Nation, if you really break it down to brass t tax, the level of your success is a level of your problems. I mean, if you're working on low level problems today and you're still doing that a year from now, then your level of success will not have ratcheted up at all. But if you're working on really big problems a year from now, because listen, you've continued to, to hire out and delegate and make systems and scaling and leveraging, you're gonna be having higher level problems because you're having higher level success. So always think of that when you're going forward and building out your empire. So, James, we've talked about a lot of awesome stuff today. What is one key thing that you really wanna make sure a Fire Nation gets from everything that we've talked about, then give us the best way that we can find out more about you, learn more from you, give us that call to action and then we'll say goodbye.

1 (24m 17s):
Absolutely. So, I say the one, the one key thing is using that, that definition of a system, people, process and tools. Figure out what is the first brick that you need to systemize in your business, right? Is it, you know, you need to figure out some, somebody to help you with your content distribution. Is it you need to figure out somebody to help you with your, your hiring, your onboarding, your customer onboarding, like whatever it is, start getting in the habit and the mindset of being that effective CEO don't fall into the trap of being those four bad bosses that we talked about being an engaged leader and an effective CEO who starts building your empire on the bricks of those systems. So that's, that's the one big thing that and maybe there were a couple things in there, but that I would, that I would share.

1 (25m 1s):
And so, so we've, we've prepared something super special for you guys and I'm, I'm very, very happy to share that with you guys. So, it's a whole audit basically. Ooh, it's a series of worksheets that lets you go through your entire business and see where you're at. We've got a, a framework that I didn't get a chance to go into today called our, our RYG framework that will enable you to see where your systems in your business are, which ones should you be focusing on first, and then how to build those. And so, we've created a special toolkit just for Fire Nation and you guys can get that at jamespfriel.com/Fire

0 (25m 39s):
Fire Nation. You're the average of the five people you spend the most time with and you've been hanging out with JF and l d today. So, keep up that heat and if you head over to eofire.com and just type James in the search bar, the show notes page will pop up with everything that we've been talking about today. Links to everything. Best show notes in the biz. But Fire Nation, you literally have to check your pulse if you don't take this call to action. You have heard how powerful systems are throughout this entire conversation today. You are not going to get where you want to be without the right systems. You are not gonna get where you need to be Fire Nation without the right framework.

0 (26m 21s):
So, you need to head over to jamespfriel.com/fire and you spell Friel, F R I E l. So jamespfriel.com/fire. You're gonna be able to go through an audit and then get that framework that James was talking about in Fire Nation. If you are being honest with yourself and you really want to achieve success, this is a call to action you have to take because guess what? This audit and this framework is going to instantly improve your systems. Period, end of story. So, James, thank you so much for sharing your truth, your knowledge, your value with Fire Nation today.

0 (27m 1s):
For that brother, we salute you and we'll catch you on the flip side. Thanks. So awesome to be here. Hey, Fire Nation, today's value bomb content was brought to you by James and successful entrepreneurs, they accomplish big goals, huge goals. That's why I created the Freedom Journal to guide you in accomplishing your number one goal in 100 days. Fire Nation. We're talking step by step. Visit the freedom journal.com and you'll be able to acquire that journal. It's gonna be awesome. Thank you for listening to my podcast, Fire Nation. I'll catch you there or I'll catch you on the flippity flip side

LMNT (27m 40s):
LMNT is an electrolyte drink mix with everything you need and nothing you don't. Try it totally risk free today. Visit drinklmnt.com/eofire and get a free sample pack with any purchase plus a no questions asked money back guarantee. That's drinklmnt.com/eofire.

HubSpot Podcast Network (27m 59s):
Outbound Squad hosted by Jason Bay is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Tune in for convos with leading sales experts and top performing reps to help you land more meetings with your ideal clients.

Outbound Squad (28m 11s):
One of my faves, The Monthly app with Jason Ethan, where they share hacks, tips and tricks. Listen to Outbound Squad wherever you get your podcasts.